God Spot

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God Spot
This Christian Resource Blog has been created by a group of friends from around the world. Our purpose is to provide links to useful resources, some commentary on topical or doctrinal issues, a place where anyone can come with questions and a means whereby we can share our faith. And above all, to grow and encourage each other. As Christians, we believe we bear God's image in this world, and seek to glorify God's name in this endeavour. Any Christian who wants to join with us is very welcome!

Thursday, June 30, 2005

Sabbath or Sunday?

I have been under the understanding that we fellowship together on a Sunday - the first day of the week, being the day of Christ's resurrection.
As for not shopping etc on a Sunday. My parents owned a Cafe/Petrol Station when I was a kid, and although we were open on a Sunday to serve patrons, we were never allowed to buy anything. Not even an icecream when it was 105F in the shade! No swimming was allowed, and we had to make sure that our shoes were cleaned on a Saturday night as we weren't allowed to do it on a Sunday. My parents felt that if we lived this way it would be a witness to those around us. In reality it had a negative reaction on the four of us, but when I became a parent I found myself trying to set the same example to my kids. Never would I allow the girls to wear trousers to church - a mortal sin, nor buy anything! Now-a-days, it doesn't worry me what they wear - as long as they come! And if it's hot, I'll buy a coke!
But, Sundays do need to be different as we attend church to worship the Lord collectively. I believe it should be our first priority.

# posted by shellymac @ 9:03 pm

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Don't leave us Shawn!

Shawn, it's been good to have your lively discussions, but don't feel that you have to leave the Blog. Let me quote from a favourite book of mine:-
"We are learning that the diversity of nationality, the diversity of culture, and diversity of background in the same church [BLOG] is good. Diversity makes you think. On the other hand, uniformity in a church [BLOG] destroys one's need for thinking. Diversity forces you to ask questions. Uniformity lets you harden in your wrong beliefs"
I have many friends that I don't see 'eye to eye' over different issues, in and out of the church, people I've known and loved for years, but it doesn't destroy our friendship. There are times of lively discussions and we end up agreeing to disagree but we don't wipe each other off.
Please reconsider!

# posted by shellymac @ 8:54 pm

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Wednesday, June 29, 2005

Unconfessed sin and ......

Shawn I don't have unconfessed sin. In my church there is a Confession that we all say every week, and I ask for foregiveness every time I pray. At church there is also an Absolution said on God's behalf by the minister. Come to the conclusion that we don't live by the Law and do consider the laws given to and for the people then, in their situation and before the new covenant, as how we should live, us in the good year 2005. I ate some pork recently, and don't consider that I have sinned in any way. Do you and why?

Is reading from my NIV sinful or just misguided. What about my Phillips translation? BSF uses the NIV and I believe that Billy Graham and Franklin Graham quote from the NIV these days.

blessings to all Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 8:36 pm

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Tuesday, June 28, 2005

Translations

I grew up reading the King Jim, went to Bible College and changed to the RSV and now read the NIV. I certainly wouldn't burn it! I have reservations about the Good News and the Living Bible, but understand that they can be easily understood especially for a person who has never opened a Bible in their lives. Keith I too like The Message as it is very nice to read but of course is another paraphrase.
Shawn, I have a feeling that Gary has used the Phillips translation which he has had since Adam was a boy.
I'm thankful that the Holy Spirit can use any vessel to get His message across to us!
P.S. Shawn the 'Old Chap' is an endearment! I'm sure you are young (as opposed to me)and good looking! :-)

# posted by shellymac @ 8:44 pm

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Law & Grace

Oh dear! All this deep study on the Law and on Grace is making me dizzy. There was a time when I could argue the 'fors' and 'againsts' quite well, but the brain in my old age is beginning to seize up. I do know that the Law was given with the future in mind - the Ultimate Sacrifice for sins - Christ's death. Ultimately the Law was given to show people that it was impossible to keep and that Christ was and is the only One who is able to fulfil it. I know that I cannot possibly keep the Law and I'm so grateful that Christ took all my shortcomings and sins in His own body on the Cross.
Keith wrote: - Grace emphatically does not mean that we can just do what we want. I have never come across any believing Christian who believes that to be . Shawn, you questioned this, but a true believer in Christ does not keep just 'doing what they want' all the time just because they know that God will forgive them. If a true believer constantly sins they will never have true peace in their lives. We had a dear friend who was a believer, but he was never able to live the 'victorious Christian life' due to his addiction to drugs. When he passsed away we (my husband and I) knew for a certainly that he had gone to be with the Lord.
If I had to live under the Law, I would have been abandoned years ago as I'm one of the biggest sinners around. Thank Christ for the Cross!

# posted by shellymac @ 8:26 pm

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Monday, June 27, 2005

The Law will not pass away

Jesus said the Law would not pass away and it hasn't -- we can easily read it today in our bibles. And Shawn you are right it shows us much of God. But in the OT too is a God who wants repentance, and people to live loving Him and others.

Keith is right too. The Law has passed away in terms of being for us to keep and live by. We are to live under grace, knowing we are saved, doing God's will for us, and caring for others.

Stop being legalistic Shawn, are you not making life miserable for yourself?

blessings to you and all in this group. from Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 9:50 pm

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No Shawn and a good bible

Ok Shawn you have some raised good points.

When I got my favourite bible out, which gives the most exact tranlations from the Greek and Hebrew Rev. 22:16 reads

I, Jesus, sent the angel of me, to wittness these things over the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Star bright and morning.

and Is 14:13

O shining star son of the morning how you have from the heavens fallen. You weakening the nations, you are cut down to the ground.

Right, one verse refers to Jesus and one to Satan, clearly! The same words, different times and subjects in the sentences.
1. Don't take verses and words in isolation
and 2. Its a problem what is the correct meaning. Has Satan corrupted the nations or is Satan corrupting the nations today.

I will continue that the NIV is a good translation and translating is full of difficulties.

# posted by Anonymous @ 9:22 pm

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Sunday, June 26, 2005

Any day will do me

I don't care which day one has church and I would be happy with Thursday night, maybe happier. I do object to sport being on the morning of the church day, and Sunday in Australia has become a big sporting day. We go home often past football grounds which are full of games of juniors playing. I won't do St. Johns first aid ahead of church.

Are not Christians supposed to live it 7 days a week.

I don't like having time wasted so I hope for good singing, prayers, and teaching at the church we go to, and I usually get it.

Our church attendance is dropping a little, that's why I want them to recruit a big name. If Darlene Zscherch is unavailable for contractual reasons, perhaps Amy Grant would like to come to Australia. Next choice is Joy, who I went to school with, but is she good value being one of the liklies for the first woman bishop in this country.

Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:39 pm

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Saturday, June 25, 2005

far and close

Agreement Shawn, there are parts of the Law that have been replaced by the Jesus and the New Covenant. You can keep the dietary laws, most will not, and most Christians will go with St. Paul's line of all things are permissable but some things are not desirable for us. (I think he was pre some types of drugs).

More of an important issue is what should a Christian be doing, and be doing to be seen different and better to the world. This is not easy for what we do is in private -- I've yet to pray standing in the middle of a busy road at peak time. We give in private and church is private in the sense of being in four walls of a building.

Shirley and I don't shop on a Sunday, or eat out for we think that forces people into working, when only essential srvices should. We keep our spending down to modest items, not the latest and greatest, fastest and flashest. I think that both of us are happy.

That's a start, others keep going .......

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:13 am

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Friday, June 24, 2005

All Blacks and Lions

Hey you Aussies! I have something sporty to talk about!!!!!!!

In support of the Big Game all the kids in our city from Primary to HighSchool ages had mufti day today - but all had to wear black in support of the All Blacks! It was called "Black Out Day"!

Just had to add this as it's at least about sport!

Have a lovely weekend everyone - see you next week sometime!

# posted by Caroline @ 2:59 pm

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Thursday, June 23, 2005

IDs in Australia

Carol and Shawn, with the failure of an Australian government to get the people to agree to National ID cards something like 10 years ago -- the people thought it was a good idea until they realized that they would be caught themselves cheating on their tax -- the Tax File Number has become basically the ID number. Its needed on so many things now.

Shawn I'm glad that you are 'thick skinned', perhaps a rare American, but lets face it most of us don't live by most of the Laws of the O.T. In my view those laws were to organise and protect a nomadic society where there were no jails, (so we get so many monetary penalties), and were there were no doctors and no refridgeration. Those of this view like mine make a distinction between the moral laws of God and the laws to regulate a society that is different to ours. Thus if I have a sore or skin problem I go to the doctor, not to show it to the priest, and I happily eat pork.

I'm still working on my contention that the church should be run like a football club. Is Darlene Zscherch under contract to Hillsong? Does she have an agent? Superboxes at the back in my church?

View fellow supporters? Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:52 pm

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Wednesday, June 22, 2005

Welcome Hank & Tears in Sport.

Nice to meet you Hank. Your first time on the Blog and you can use a colour. I still can't work out how to do it!

Well the mightly Aussie team has fallen from grace badly this Tour of the Ashes. Maybe it will keep them humble - no - probably not, they will rise again I'm sure. My youngest daughter is thrilled about their failings as she thinks they are an arrogant bunch.

Carol - I just love the way you express yourself! I've shed some tears in Sport. It was way back in the dark ages when you couldn't have live coverage. Lionel Rose took the World Championship in Boxing and it was held in Japan(I think). I was living in Drouin (in Gippsland, Victoria) and remember sitting up close to the Radio as we all sat and listened to the fight. My dad often gave him a ride to school and each time he'd ask Lionel what he wanted to be when he grew up he would say 'A Boxer'. (My claim to fame is that I knew Lionel as a young bloke and also Gary Ablett - I am absolutely positive that they wouldn't have a clue who I am.)

Shawn old chap - my daughter turns 25 tomorrow and is coming home for Sunday Lunch to celebrate with the family. Her request for lunch - Roast Pork Dinner and Golden Syrup Dumplings for dessert!!I will be thinking of you as we sit down. I only have one tiny piece of pork and choose to have beef as pork is too rich for me.

# posted by shellymac @ 7:58 pm

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Hey Shawn!

Shawn - I've enjoyed your participation even though you and I don't see eye to eye on everything. BUT tell us (or me) about yourself!! Are you tall or short, fat or thin? Are you married or eligable? Half a dozen kids or none at all?
Us old geizers (well me anyway) would like to know so that I can picture you in my mind:-)

# posted by shellymac @ 7:54 pm

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the obvious reason why we write on sport

Welcome Hank, after a little difficuly for you. Another entry on sport! Good on you Mate!

Now it is clear to me that we are on the right track, but we haven't made the great obvious jump in thinking, here is it, a church should be like a football club, no a church is like a football club, we don't relise it of admit it.

Is there a book in this, of course, The Manchester United Driven Church.

Yes fellow supporters, Are not many churches success driven, and are the successful Christian people copied, (eg clones of Darlene Zschech, the star of Hillsong in Sydney for those who don't know who she is though their tv programs go to 125 countries according to the latest "Alive" magazine). I will leave the rest to you.

blessings from Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 7:20 pm

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Tuesday, June 21, 2005

Sport

I am so excited - I can finally share something about sport!!!!! (As you know, sport is a topic like car engines to me - not only do I not know a thing about it, but it is even distasteful!!!!)

My uncle told me yesterday, that apparently Michael Campbell, a Maori from New Zealand, won the world title for golf. Apparently he is the best golfer in the world! My uncle told me, it moved him to tears when he saw this on tv happening!

I must admit I wasn't at all moved to tears, but I was able to enter in very briefly to a slight arousing of excitement in my heart. Perhaps "excitement" isn't the word, but for the VERY brief moment this feeling popped into my heart, I felt something anyway!!!!

# posted by Caroline @ 12:20 pm

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National ID in NZ

Shawn,

I asked my husband this

Is there a national I.D. mandatory in Australia or New Zealand yet?

and he said No, not at all!

Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 12:17 pm

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Monday, June 20, 2005

on right and wrong

I trust we now agree that legalism is a terrible thing and we should love God's ways and want to do them. Legalisms are man made and so are traditions. And God's ways for us are about following his ways , (agree with you Shawn) to show we love Him, and loving others even our enemies and those ignorant football followers of teams below the mighty magnificent Brisbane Lions.
An idea on sin, (from when I was close to the R.C. Church having taught in one of their schools). If I drop the hammer on my toes and say in pain some words that I shouldn't, that is a minor and 'venial' sin, whereas if I steal intentionally from the employer day after day that is a 'mortal' sin, that I really need to confess and stop doing it. Then God will foregive me.
If my jacket is wool blended, ie a garment made with two threads, is that a sin?

Keith cannot equate and English summer with lots of rain, mmmm.
Come on the mighty Melbourne Storm to beat the South Sydney Rabbitos this week. I'm a rugby fan now as well, we need an excursion or two.

Who uses still the Authorised Version of King James , the KJV?
blessings to you all from Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:58 pm

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Sunday, June 19, 2005

Pagans & Christians.

Shawn - I agree that we must be different from those around us and yes, we need to confess our sin. But we also need to be careful that we don't get so caught up on legalism that we miss out on the joy that Christ can give us.
There was a time when there were many things that I would not do, but over time I came to realise that I was putting myself under legalism and rules. Yes, we must be a witness to others, but we also need to treat others with grace.
In our church we have many different cultures and I've learnt that my upbringing is not the same as theirs. They do things that I would have called wrong at one stage - now I'm learning that each person has their own walk with the Lord. But of course, we don't want to cause a weaker brother or sister to stumble and we need to be mindful of this.

# posted by shellymac @ 5:24 pm

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Hank is joining I think

I hope that Hank is joining this group and can get a good amount in. He lives in London near all the great spots and sports places (except for the Arsenal ground).It is summer time there and both Hank and Keith are great gardeners, and may only write when its raining, um often then???Forget football, the mighty Melbourne Storm are playing at home again next Saturday night. Carol do you follow the Aukland Warriors?blessings to all and prayers for all in the group. Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:20 pm

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The Religion of Football.

We here in Australia are extremely religious when it come to Australian Rules Football, more so in Victoria than the other states. People worship it. One of the handcapped kids I use to care for would need a sedative when his team lost.
Contrary to popular opinion we don't all barrack for Essendon over here. Well - I go for two teams ( a mortal sin I think). One half of me supports Essendon, and the other half goes for Geelong. When I was a teenager our minister's son supported Geelong and he was 'pretty hot' so I decided to barrack for Geelong!! There was a game today between the Brisbane Lions and Geelong and we generously allowed the other team to win. By a huge margin too. One day I would like to go to a match between Essendon and Geelong with my husband, daughter and son-in-law. Wilfred & Naomi would be yelling for Essendon and Dave and I would be yelling for Geelong.

# posted by shellymac @ 5:16 pm

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Quakers & Brethren Assembly.

Keith - glad you found your way back here. First up the apostrophe. I don't know about the other 'bloggers', but when I write something in Word and then cut and paste onto the Blog my apostrophes turn out the same as yours. I then go in and edit by removing them and retyping them. Beats me if this is the right way, but it works for me! But I have no idea how people get colours and bold print and italics.
The Quakers by your description - waiting in silence, reminds me of the Brethren Assembly. Now-a-days they are more open, but when I would visit my sister's church in Rokeby (near Warragul in Victoria, Australia - for the un-educated person on Australian towns!), there would be no music played, and we would all sit in silence until the Spirit of God would move someone and he (only a he, not a she)would get up and share from the Word or begin a hymn which we would all join in singing (but no organ or piano). My husband came from a similar background in India as well. I found it quite difficult to adjust to it as I had been brought up in the Methodist and then changed over to the Baptist. After we were married we attended a Brethren Assembly in Yarra Junction (a little country town in the hills), and then after that at Ringwood. I never felt completely at home at these services, although my husband enjoyed them. We were then called to this little church in the North Western suburbs of Melbourne which is a mixure of Brethren Assembly, Baptist and Church of Christ.
Keith if you believe in your heart that you are in the place that God wants you to be in, then that is great. I'm sure that He can use you significantly.
I learnt sign language for a short time when I was working with handicapped children. I'm very slow though and have to spell everything out fully with the alphabet so that by the time I get to the end of the word I forget what I was saying anyway! it is a great tool and I reckong it should be taught in the schools rather than the usual French which I didn't like one bit.

# posted by shellymac @ 5:03 pm

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some wisdom

Well not much wisdom from me, but 'yes', I'm sure that God wants Christians to be different to the pagans. They were some good quotes, Shawn, and in gentleness and kindness we are to be the light of the world. And the conscience of the world, especially in politics. Is the seperation of church and state biblical? I wonder and doubt.

We dont get far from football, Keith, in melbourne football, means Australan rules football and probably the Australian Football League where I follow the mighty Brirsbane Lions, (not doing so well yet) and Geoff follows the sub-humans of the Melbourne and I think Michele and her family follow the lower than sub-humans in Essendon. Should we pray for these poor types .... well maybe the mighty magnificent men of the Brisbane Lions.

Actually, the football teams do have chaplains and Essendon are noted for treating their chaplain as a significant person in the club.

I went to my first rugby game last night and am an istant convert to the mighty Melbourne Storm, but alas there are sub-humans in rugby as the Penrith Panthers ran over the Storm in the second half. Rugby is far better there at the ground than on television.

Re Christians being different to the pagans aagain, my good wife Shirley stunned and shocked to hair roots them at a meeting once when she said she didn't believe that Christians should own investment properties! How to make friends, Shirl???

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:16 am

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Saturday, June 18, 2005

Loving the Lord

Mat 22:35 Then one of them, [which was] a lawyer, asked [him a question], tempting him, and saying,
Mat 22:36 Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

I am a VERY simple person and I am SO grateful someone wanted to test Jesus with this question. This way, we received a most wonderful answer, straight from the mouth of God, through His Son Jesus.

And so my simple minded process of thinking then thinks:

Mat 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

And then finally - what are the things added to me, once I love God with everything I have and my neighbours (all of mankind)?

Gal 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Gal 5:23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. Is this too simple? These fruits will be shown to all mankind - to all we love - and seen by the Lord.

It all starts with having the Lord God dwelling within (and we know we must do this through Jesus Christ - and all that that means!). I love the way God has made everything so simple that even a nine year old can understand. (Can't you tell I have little kids and get used to explaining things very simply!!!)

In love, this quite nice Saturday morning (weather wise!) in New Zealand.

Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 9:10 am

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Loving the Lord

Mat 22:35
Then one of them, [which was] a lawyer, asked [him a question], tempting him, and saying,

Mat 22:36
Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?

Mat 22:37
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.

Mat 22:38
This is the first and great commandment.

Mat 22:39
And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Mat 22:40
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

I am a VERY simple person and I am SO grateful someone wanted to test Jesus with this question. This way, we received a most wonderful answer, straight from the mouth of God, through His Son Jesus.

And so my simple minded process of thinking then thinks:

Mat 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

And then finally - what are the things added to me, once I love God with everything I have and my neighbours (all of mankind)?

Gal 5:22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Gal 5:23
Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

Is this too simple? These fruits will be shown to all mankind - to all we love - and seen by the Lord. It all starts with having the Lord God dwelling within (and we know we must do this through Jesus Christ - and all that that means!).

I love the way God has made everything so simple that even a nine year old can understand.

In love, this quite nice Saturday morning (weather wise!) in New Zealand.
Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 9:00 am

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Spare me some more

Are we still talking about eating pork and did I read that it needs to be confessed so as to have a right relationship with God. For once I paused and thought (hard stuff) and yes a right relationship with God comes from repentance with should involve confession and a desire to live His way and not to continue in sins. But for the last time, I see all healthy foods as quite right.

And is someone still using a King James Version?

Back to foods, you learned people help, could I say that
1. the O.T. dietary laws were to care for a nomadic people with no refridgeration
2. to have the people of God different to the pagans around them

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:55 am

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Friday, June 17, 2005

I've seen the light

Yes, Geoff I'm not going to the Melbourne - West Coast game tomorrow, I'm doing st. johns at the mighty Melbourne Storm game in the evening, (and actually Xavier in the morning).

I let myself into a comment from Carol, that God is a therapist, and He is. I know He understands me and guides. I think that He is a 'behavouralist' for its often, 'the past is gone and foregiven now get on with what I want for you in the future'. I once had a wonderful experience 'alone' in a church at 3am, of course a Christian is never alone!

If Shawn most divorces are wrong, often a person 'walks out' on the partner who didn't want the divorce and is 'innocent', the marriage is legally over, sins can be foregiven and it should be ok for a re-marriage. The true faith is for all.

Comments everyone.........

# posted by Anonymous @ 9:28 pm

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Greg Williams & reservation

Geoff, your mention of Greg Williams brought back to to my mind an incident several years ago.
It was Mother's Day and we had made a reservation at "Chung On", a Chinese resturant in Moonee Ponds. We rolled up there with all our kids to have a meal. As we were waiting for our table to become free, who should walk in but Greg Williams and his family. But, unfortunately Greg had not made a reservation and was turned away (quite rudely I thought at the time), we turned to the waiter and asked him if he knew who he had turned away. He didn't, so we explained to him that he was the Brownlow Medalist. The waiter shrugged his shoulders and said 'no reservation, no table'.
I turned to Wilf and said to him that he could get a good sermon out of it! If we don't have a reservation for Heaven then we won't get in, no matter how important we might be!!
By the way - it was one of the worst tasting meals that we've ever had, and we have never gone back there since!

# posted by shellymac @ 9:25 pm

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Carol - Sport

Carol,

Here is an article on a footballer we have the privilege to watch, who has a physical gift which speaks (to me at least) of the wonder of God's hand in creating such skills in man. The guy is Travis Johnstone and you won't want to read the whole article, but here's a good comment:

Travis Johnstone glides on a football field with the ease of a sea bird. Or, as coach Neale Daniher has suggested, the flourish we once saw from Mark Waugh's bat. The grace with which "Trav" can play football is his alone, a signature as unmistakeable as was Waugh's mellifluous timing.

The rub for Johnstone, of course, as he makes his way through his eighth season with Melbourne, is the invitation to believe that because his gifts appeal so much, much of what he can do with the ball in his hand is truly effortless. In turn, this leads to a further conclusion: that his successes are God-given, his failures the damning result of a lack of exertion or will.

For the footy fanatics here, Greg Williams is another who had a special gift (different from Trav's gift) - the gift of amazing perception of time and space. And Gary, painful as it is to say, Brisbane Lions have their share and more of such gifted individuals!

# posted by geoff @ 3:23 pm

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Pork?

Shawn,

I respect your conviction regarding pork, but it's not mine. Here are some verses that have sprung to mind reading your posts, some more or less supportive of your stance, others perhaps less so (from the ESV translation):

1Cor9:1-5 "Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are not you my workmanship in the Lord? If to others I am not an apostle, at least I am to you, for you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord. This is my defense to those who would examine me. Do we not have the right to eat and drink? Do we not have the right to take along a believing wife, as do the other apostles and the brothers of the Lord and Cephas?"

1Cor9:19-21 "For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them. To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law. To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law."

Ro14:2-3 "One person believes he may eat anything, while the weak person eats only vegetables. Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him."

Ro4:14-17 "I know and am persuaded in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself, but it is unclean for anyone who thinks it unclean. For if your brother is grieved by what you eat, you are no longer walking in love. By what you eat, do not destroy the one for whom Christ died. So do not let what you regard as good be spoken of as evil. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit."

Ro4:20-21 "Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats. It is good not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything that causes your brother to stumble."

I think there's enough wisdom in all these passages from Paul, studied in context, for each to be personally convicted, and then to do what it says - treat each other with love and respect, and pursue righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit!

Shalom, trust the day back at work goes well!
Geoff

# posted by geoff @ 2:53 pm

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Pork

I can't enter into this topic as

1. It is too expensive here to feed our bunch
2. I hate the taste and it makes my stomach feel queasy
3. Even thinking about it as something to eat disturbs the peace of my tummy

4. If, as a remote, almost impossible possibility I was faced with it and thought about eating it, I would pray and receive a yes or a no. I would go by that. Geoff - come here - do you have any thoughts from the Lord through His Word on this topic??

Signing off feeling queasy even thinking about it .....

# posted by Caroline @ 7:41 am

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Things

Gary

Alas, (not said too convingly) I'm 55 and 5 weeks off 56. But in good health, which I consider a great blessing. I don't dye my hair, or go to a gym, or a therapist though I probably need one.

47
Helped-along hair
Gym member
Therapist (God).

I criticise myself, and wish, each day, that I could undo a number of things that I have done.

God tells me daily, that once we repent for any of these things, the moment starts anew right at that moment. Don't knock yourself out over it - God knows your heart and when He knows when it is truly sorry, He in His great love and kindness is right ready to forgive. He told me once, when I was so ashamed of myself before Him in something, that the fact I actually came to Him in repentance and discussed it, meant more to Him than I will ever know. Face up and forget. Just had to mention this, as what you said has been a problem for me in the past too. But He dealt with that. He's the best therapist we could ever have!!

It worries me that we are all very busy.

Well Gary, we actually don't need to be! I will tell you what I believe and anyone here is MOST welcome to challenge this belief. I believe that God does not wish us to be so busy. And that it is influences outside of God which have created and are creating with greater frenzy, people to be as busy as they are today. I believe, that if we radically change our lives so that we are no longer "too busy" and absolutely trust the Lord will take care of things, then peoples lives will change completely. I have experienced this personally. I stopped working (even though we were going through a TERRIBLE financial experience - as I saw our children floundering badly with a Mum who was working all day and coming home too tired and stressed to even hardly say hello to them) I gave up all my interests (I used to paint, and sew everything we wore! We used to have a lot of social life.) and all this in search of having more time for family and God. Somehow, there was enough money. I honestly shudder when I wonder how we did it. Oh, we felt the job lack very much, but the change within our home life was worth every bit. Not just for then, not just for now, but I believe for all eternity. You just have to hand it all over to the Lord, learn to trust (how many people really truly know trust in the Father until they do something radical in some area??) and then live in God's moment. Whoops, I could write more and more on this topic - but better stop before it becomes a book!

Mmm deep down I am looking forward to BSF, Bible Study Fellowship. It is a great way to study the Bible.

Really glad to hear it!!!!!!!

Love Caro

# posted by Caroline @ 7:15 am

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Geoff - Creator - Sport

Geoff

Some of the greatest and fittest athletes play Aussie Rules football, and I never watch without amazement and praise to such a wonderful Creator.

Well well - I have NEVER thought of this aspect of sport!!!! The praise to the Creator when you watch. Is it the fitness of people which makes you feel like this? Or is it the game itself? Or the team effort, or what? Oh, DO please excuse my ignorance here - I think I watched a rugby game once on TV with a very avid and knowledgable rugby fan and they patiently took the time to explain a few things. But that was way back. And so I speak from total ignorance here.

And when we have dinner in August one night, I hope we don't need to discuss football or any other ball!

Keep posting!!!!

# posted by Caroline @ 7:07 am

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Thursday, June 16, 2005

A new member I hope

I have invited Hank who lives in London not far from the queen to join this group. Welcome, but having said that, I'm going to bed: us cab drivers need to get there soon for my alarm clock goes off at 4.15am and its 10.15pm now. Well it is in Australia, we are ahead of most of the other members in something at least.
I'm so pleased about Douglas Woods being released, excellent and an answer to many peoples prayers.

# posted by Anonymous @ 10:12 pm

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Contentment - The Secret of Life

Just thought I would share this nice reading that my husband and I read this morning:-
A bishop of the early Church who was a remarkable example of contentment was asked his secret. The old man replied, "It consists in nothing more than making a right use of my eyes. In whatever circumstance I am, I first of all look up to heaven and remember that my principal business here is to get there; I then look down upon the earth, and remember how small a place I shall occupy in it when I die and am buried; I then look abroad in the world and observe what multitudes there are who are in all respects more unhappy than myself. Thus I learn where true happiness is placed, where all our cares must end, and what little reason I have to complain." (from 15 Minute Devotions For Couples by Bob & Emilie Barnes)

# posted by shellymac @ 9:16 pm

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Guns & Pork

Shawn, we have very strict gun laws over here. Self-defence? Yes, but the law so often gets all tangled up and if you are defending yourself, it could even go against you. Although just this week we have had an 'underworld' figure aquitted for murder as apparently he shot under self-defence.
Um - I don't ask for forgiveness when I eat pork, but I do say Grace and thank the Lord for it!! I eat meat on Fridays and have Roast Beef on Good Friday, and yet I had a very legalistic upbringing. This may be a subject where we might have to agree to disagree! :-)

# posted by shellymac @ 9:10 pm

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Pork on pizza? spare me

Someone needs a lesson in making a good pizza ... no each to their own tastes. I quite enjoy the differences, each to their own.

Shawn and I have a been having a discussion on divorce, and I have taken the view that the true faith is for all, no mater what their marriage standing, (or other wrongs), and that some marriages break down, and are 'dead'. From there the people should be free to re- marry after a divorce, though a divorce should not occur easily and be done lightly. Were many of the bible's teachings --
1. to comply with the customs of the day, and 2. in consideration that the Lord would return within weeks, months or at most a couple of years? and perhaps 3. exagerations to get people thinking?

Pork on pizzas when you can have salami, mushrooms, olives, and pineapple.

Re carrying guns, I thought about it and 'yes' in freedom people should have the right to own a gun, but in Christian love, disputes should be settled by words and understanding. Perhaps there is a use for a gun in self defence, (but in law that might be held to be excessive and criminal).

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:45 pm

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Quakers

Welcome Keith - I hope you find your way back here soon. Can you enlighten us as to the differences between the Baptist religion and the Quaker religion?
Years ago when we were first married my husband and I nearly went to a Quaker meeting but chickened out.
Hope your Meniere's disease doesn't cause you too much discomfort. I'm in stage 1 of it, the Doctor said to cut down on Coke and Salt - he may as well have told me to stop breathing....

# posted by shellymac @ 10:05 am

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Guns

I found the site on carrying guns quite interesting - especially this quote - "Arms are the only true badges of liberty. The possession of arms is the distinction of a free man from a slave" - Andrew Fletcher.
Wow! Here in the Land from Down Under, freedom of carrying guns would mean a much depleted nation as everyone would be getting knocked off!
"distinction of a free man from a slave" - I think that we would lose our freedom and become slaves to the firearms.

# posted by shellymac @ 10:01 am

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Shawn

Oh boy! You are certainly giving a bit of colour to this blog!!

# posted by shellymac @ 10:00 am

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Wednesday, June 15, 2005

On being old, yeah me

Alas, (not said too convingly) I'm 55 and 5 weeks off 56. But in good health, which I consider a great blessing. I don't dye my hair, or go to a gym, or a therapist though I probably need one.

And I 'get into' people and myself. I criticise myself, and wish, each day, that I could undo a number of things that I have done. You know the prayer that goes, Lord I haven't been hurtful or ill tempered today etc, but now I have to get out of bed so it might not continue.

I agonise over the church. When I write the complete critique of the church it will be called 'Empires and Egos'. Enough, but St. John's is 'Egos and Favouritism', he writes while battling for a place at the Delta Goodrem concert. "First in best dressed" means really that the co-ordinator is saving places for his friends.

It worries me that we are all very busy. Do we need a dose of Catholicism, as well as a bigger dose of peace.

Oh I'm raving on nearly as much as Michele. Ah but thanks for an update on Gary Ablett. I can handle complicated people. I always liked Paul Keeting?

Shawn do you not eat pork? I do, had some on Saturday at the MCG. Geoff us st. j's people get fed nearly as well as you rich members.

Mmm deep down I am looking forward to BSF, Bible Study Fellowship. It is a great way to study the Bible. And Pat it comes from Texas, wherever that is.

Enough, blessing to all, Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:48 pm

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Football - Pat

Pat, great to hear of your love of sport, and your sons' athleticism. Watching the grace and skill of good athletes, whatever the sport, causes one to praise the skill and creativity of God in creating mankind to do what we can, physically.

Some of the greatest and fittest athletes play Aussie Rules football, and I never watch without amazement and praise to such a wonderful Creator. I think Paul would have enjoyed a good game of football, too.

What are your boys up to now?

# posted by geoff @ 4:45 pm

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Welcome Pat, Shawn & Keith...

...and from what I hear, many others that Gary is getting around to recruiting (poor Igor came up after Monday night's leaders' mtg at BSF and asked with a puzzled brow "what's this blogger stuff that Gary keeps asking me to join?").

Anyway Igor is a great guy (like Gary, altho I never tell him that but with his football team in the doldrums maybe he wouldn't get too big a head if I did), so I encouraged Igor to join.

I am Geoff from Australia (land of Oz), attend a home-church fellowship and think this blog is great for forgetting all about denominational boundaries and learning from each others' varied experiences - while celebrating the core common faith that we all as Christians share. And with Carol, I welcome you all!

I promise to write something substantial soon; meanwhile, shalom!

# posted by geoff @ 4:36 pm

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God took care of you?

Hello Pat,

I was interested in a comment you made:

God has taken care of us today and protected us from worse weather.

I have said things like that and got looked at sideways. I believe we underestimate how much the Lord sees and watches us and actually does protect us. But this is a HUGE topic. Maybe we can chat about it sometime.

Love Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 3:35 pm

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Keith

Hello Keith,

It is really nice to meet you. You have a nice and friendly style and I look forward to hearing more from you. I do hope you find your way back here often.

I read a lovely story a few years ago about the Quakers. It was of a young couple, of which the girl, had family back in the Quaker church, and this couple lived in the heart of a huge American city. They went to visit her family all in the Quaker church way back in a peaceful part of the country somewhere, and you watched these two young people become immersed in the love of the family and people, and eventually find the Lord. I thought this was a beautiful story.

Anyway, we shall keep in touch, I hope.

Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 3:31 pm

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Gary back at BSF??

I'm about to be stressed more, Carol. My 'friend" Geoff has filled in an enrolment form for me to go back to Bible Study Fellowship, starting mid August for the short studies. Now there are legalisms a plenty in BSF, especially for the leaders. Its a great way to study the scriptures but some weeks I'll be out 3 nights in a row. I'm getting old, maybe Geoff thinks I can't fill in my own form. I am not going to be a leader again, besides the guy in charge wouldn't have me. I'm a heretic, I use the terrible 'v' word, not to be done in churches, (the 'v' word is 'variety', and absent from most churches, mine too).

Gary - I am never sure if you are being terrifically blunt, or joking!!! Mind you, three nights in a row is quite something. You'd need the other four nights to do homework and have riviting discussions on what the three nioghts bring! At our ages (bearing in mind I wouldn't have a clue what your age is!) we like the old slippered feet beside the fire thing in the evenings, eh! I'm not even ashamed of liking it!!! Our kids give us all the excitement we need with what they get up to. (I'm just jealous! I wish I LIKED things like BSF. Maybe when I am even older, I will get there! Never say Never!)

Anyone go to "Kingdom of Heaven" movie??

# posted by Caroline @ 3:25 pm

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Oh my goodness! The blog!

Help Geoff! The blog is happening so fast that we are being left behind!!!!!!!!

Thanks so much to all the newcomers; and Michelle and Gary; who are filling the screen daily! This is very exciting! The blog won't know what to do with itself as it has never seen so much action!!

Straight off ... I am from NZ and I don't know a thing about sport. I fail miserably at scriptural knowledge. I don't go to BSF. But I do love the LORD GOD and Jesus Christ with all my heart, soul, mind and body.

How does my body love Him??? Good question! Well, I believe our bodies are a temple for the Lord to dwell in on this present earth. Our hearts and Souls are part of these bodies, even though only temporarily, and so we need to show respect to what the Lord has loaned us, to house our hearts and minds and Souls, which are created for His glory, for our duration here.

My favourite topics in the "christian" field, are the affairs of the heart.

Michelle - interesting about George Bush! I also have heard touching tales of his faith. Then on the other hand, you see untouching tales of someone who might not have Christ within! So, as always, I (who also don't know politics) don't worry about things like that (nothing worse than people who spout on knowledgably about things they don't actually have a clue about, and thats me if I don't look out!) and hope it all gets sorted out in time. So - is it true?? Is he really a man of God? I guess the Americans, who are very patriotic and actually a fairly God faring people in general (compared with NZ where you are actually slightly odd to pronounce yourself a christian - especially after the recent problems the leader of the Christian party here (Heritage) who professed to be such a devout Godly man - er, fell from grace. It didn't do us chirsians reputation much good! Oh well!

Interesting comments about being touchy.

Noone in our church shouts out any praise to the Lord. As you say, it would keep people awake!

# posted by Caroline @ 3:11 pm

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Tuesday, June 14, 2005

Unclean Food & Footy (Again!)

Shawn - My husband put down a few of his thoughts on unclean meats and wondered if this would be of a help to you.

Old Testament:According to the Mosiac Law, God had commanded that His people could eat the meat of animals with cloven feet, parted hooves and chewing cud (Lev 11:3ff). But they were not to eat the camel, coney, hare & swine. The pig is the chief among these. That is why the Moslems and Jews abstain seriously from 'pig-flesh' because their teachings go back to the Mosaic legislation.
Daniel 'purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself with the king's meat.'This was because the meat was first offered to idols and Daniel knew that Satan worship was behind Nebuchadnezzar's idol worship. It was either that he surrender to Satan or to Yahweh who was the One True living God. The 'pulses' that Daniel and his 3 friends lived on were fruits, vegetables & nuts -and this diet made the 4 of them smarter, more alert and 10 times better than the magicians, astrologers and the ones who ate flesh. Today Doctors often stress fruit, vegetables, nuts and the flesh of fish for various types of sicknesses.

New Testament:The prodigal in Luke 15, was away in an alien land and had spent all his substance in riotous living & had lost all his friends, money and food. He was willing to eat what the pigs ate. What a tragedy! That's all that was available to him. In Mark 5 when Jesus exorcised Legion and his numerous evil spirits they went into a great herd of swine and they ran down a hill into the sea and were drowned. Now Jesus Christ not only proved that he was Master over the demonic forces (His creation of fallen angels)but the miracle had a side affect. The pig-herders most probably were Jews and their livelihood had gone. Now they were still under the law and the Mosaic laws and regulations.

Jesus Christ: When our Lord came, not only did He fulfill the law in His life but He "Blotted out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to His cross," (Col 2:14)
- The regulations, rituals, ceremonials and all that the law required of God's people were in a sense taken up by Christ and fulfilled.
In reference to eating meat there was no longer the pressure to eat some meats and not others. Today in countries like New Guinea and some 3rd world countries, where swine can often eat unhealthy foods and faeces (not suitable for human consumption), the flesh needs to be cooked for a longer period on a slower heat to eliminate the bad bacteria. Missionaries & ex-patriots need to be very conscientious when cooking pork.

Day of Grace: Today we live in the dispensation of grace. The Mosaic Law has no more hold on us. Galatians 5:1 says "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ has made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage."
One can choose to eat whatever meat he chooses within logic and discretion. Such meat as birds of prey -vultures, raven, crows, - that thrive on vermin are not good for human consumption.
Hams, bacon & pork could be eaten if one chooses to do so. The 'heart-foundation' supply pork meals (without the fat & rind) to patients who have heart surgery because pork is the leanest meat.

Discretion: In Roman 14:2ff-Paul says that one person may believe that he can eat all things, another who is weak in faith is a strict vegetarian. Let not the non-vegetarian despise the vegetarian or vice-versa, because each man is responsible in his conscience before God.
Hope that helps you a bit Shawn.

Also my father would never allow anyone of the family to eat 'Black Pudding' (which is made out of blood) - Now this could be a contradiction to what I just wrote about being under Grace. But if my Dad said not to, then I wouldn't, just because it was Dad!

Pat - the footy that you love I am sure is different to our footy which is Australian Rules! Your men wear protective clothing all over their bodies. Our blokes don't have any protective clothing except for Teeth guards.

Gary Ablett - On Sunday I was talking to my son's mate who once roomed with Gary Ablett for two years. Claude got a phone call from Gary on Thursday night. He is not at a Depression Clinic as the Media states, but is at Teen Challenge in Kyabram. He has gone through all the steps required and is now on staff helping other young people who are struggling with drug and alcohol addiction. Gary has to live with what happened for the rest of his life and he remembers it every day. But, he is going on for the Lord in a wonderful way.

# posted by shellymac @ 8:56 pm

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Monday, June 13, 2005

going on

Shawn I agree and like the way you put it: we believe, we repent and accept God's love (to add a bit) and then we follow God's laws to show we believe and love. We in Australia don't know enough about the Patriot Act, so thanks for the information and that you think that George W a Christian to some degree.

We are not to judge, God will do that, but we are to notice and appreciate the fruits that people show, and to correct fellow Christians the right way.

You need something odd. We had a holiday today because its the Queen's birthday, that is, its the Queen of England's birthday, no its not, her's is in April, so its not her birthday but we have a holiday for the Queen of England's birthday, on a day that's not her birthday. I think it was Queen Victoria's birthday who is now dead, so we have a holiday for a living foreigner's birthday on a day that is not her birthday, on a dead relative's birthday. All this shows that I'm a republican, and pleased to say that I voted for a republic in that refferundum that John Howard conned the simple people to vote against the republic.

Next time Americans we have a 'dig' at a few weird things that happen in your country, remind us about the Queens birthday.

And again I've said nothing about football, though I've just put myself in for a st. john's duty at either the football this week or the rugby wherever I'm needed. Time for some 'plonk' whihs is Aus. slang for .........

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:47 pm

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Sunday, June 12, 2005

a quiet Sunday

Oh my, 3 things have been written without anything on football. I'll only mention it by saying I went there yesterday with st. johns and treated two people, and had to do Workcover reports (workers insurance) for both were staff of the meals supplying company.

And Shawn you want to get into writing about unclean foods. Is that things that are not washed, while drinking a cup of coffee -- a stimulant and frowned upon in some churches. Go for it, but expect and argument. Legalism?

Pat and Shawn, I am convinced that George W gets terrible treatment by the press in this country. I hope that his faith is genuine, tell us more.

I'm about to be stressed more, Carol. My 'friend" Geoff has filled in an enrolment form for me to go back to Bible Study Fellowship, starting mid August for the short studies. Now there are legalisms a plenty in BSF, especially for the leaders. Its a great way to study the scriptures but some weeks I'll be out 3 nights in a row. I'm getting old, maybe Geoff thinks I can't fill in my own form. I am not going to be a leader again, besides the guy in charge wouldn't have me. I'm a heretic, I use the terrible 'v' word, not to be done in churches, (the 'v' word is 'variety', and absent from most churches, mine too).

mmmm time to go. blessing to you all from gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 5:29 am

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Saturday, June 11, 2005

Hi Shawn & Pat

Welcome to this site. I'm Michele and have my roots in the country but now live in a suburb of Melbourne Australia, I've got four kids, with two married and my husband is a Pastor.

Nice to see the way your name is spelt Shawn - just like it sounds - and not like our old friend Sean Connery. It will be good to get your input and Pat's into this site.

As for the unclean foods - I'll have to look into it. Having just come home from shopping my brain isn't firing on all four cylinders.

My sister-in-law who lives in LA just sent us a book entitled "Man of Faith - the Spiritual Journey of George W Bush". Have either of you read it?
This is a bit ---"Nobody spends more time on his knees than George W Bush, The Bush administration hums to the sound of prayer. Prayer meetings take place day and night. It's not uncommon to see White House functionaries hurrying down corridors carrying Bibles" (pg 158) Another bit that is on the blurb - "I'm not after the votes...I am here [in the Oval Office]...sharing concerns because someday I'm going to stand before God, and I want to hear Him say, 'Well Done!' I hope that's why we are all here.- George W.Bush"
I know that we have a world divided with people who either love him or hate him. Seeing he hasn't dropped into my home I can't say that I know the man. I have conflicting views myself, and when my eldest son saw the book he couldn't believe it and didn't agree with it.

On the next subject:-
"Touchiness, too, is a mark of the sinful self. The more prickly a person is, the more he or she is using the defence of a false self. Some people bristle easily if they are not taken seriously, thus betraying their need to cover up feelings of unimportance. Others take themselves too seriously and are unable to laugh as themselves. All these things suggest we are not comfortable with our inner selves. We are living falsely rather than truly."

I can get very touchy - and I have alot of sinful self. When I was a teenager I was like a prickly pear, which when it was boiled down showed major insecurities, which with God's help I am learning each day to live with and to some extent, overcome.
So many times we cover up our true feelings.My grandmother would always say to keep a "stiff upper lip" and not get too emotional. Shock, horror if there were to be a visitor in our church who would call out 'Amen' or 'hallelujah'!
I don't mind it now-a-days, at least it shows that the congregation aren't all sleeping.
Later - Michele

# posted by shellymac @ 2:15 pm

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Relaxing but gearing up

Good stuff Shawn on getting through the instructions, I find most things hard the first time and often the second, then it becomes easy. And show some 'fire for the Lord' on the group, and some 'colour' too. No one in years has commented on my e-mail address, 'garypax' where pax is latin for peace.

Now we all need peace, especially God's peace, His confort, His love, His care. We are not alone: His is helping us when we do His will.

I told Shawn that he could call me a 'crackpot', and I don't offend easily, and on that I wish to share something and have your thoughts:

"Touchiness, too, is a mark of the sinful self. The more prickly a person is, the more he or she is using the defence of a false self. Some people bristle easily if they are not taken seriously, thus betraying their need to cover up feelings of unimportance. Others take themselves too seriously and are unable to laugh as themselves. All these things suggest we are not comfortable with our inner selves. We are living falsely rather than truly."

This is from a daily series from the fine British Christian writer, Selwyn Hughes. Shirley and I do the study each day, and at present he is on about us Christians having a right understanding of ourselves. He puts to me many a good idea, no thats not quite right, he puts to me clarity of what I've probably had before in reading, hearing or thinking about. ("he" meaning a man insprired by God to communicate).

You folk to do, blessings from Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:12 am

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Friday, June 10, 2005

Shawn and Pat

Shawn and Pat, a really warm welcome from me. I live in NZ. A mother, with four sons.

Gary, thankyou so much for bringing Shawn and Pat along here.

Their input will be wonderful - er.... do they like football too????

# posted by Caroline @ 12:12 pm

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Thursday, June 09, 2005

New Member: Shawn

I have asked Shawn to join the group today. He lives in St. Louise and is married, changing careers, locations and probably churches, but not the family of 4 cats. Welcome.

# posted by Anonymous @ 9:20 pm

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New Member: Pat

Pat (Thomas) is joining the group, I hope she can do the computer starting part. Welcome Pat. She is a mom and a grandmom, I think mom is Amercian for mother and I'll not tease anyone any more. Pat is also involved in some good groups and I certainly support the premise of One Million Moms and One Million 'Dads.

blessings to all, Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:43 pm

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Wednesday, June 08, 2005

my few ideas

Carol my agreement too on your children taking part in church, to me it would be delightful. Tell them we all are pleased, and God will be pleased if they do their best.

I'm pleased we have drifted off football, but thanks for the comments on Gary Ablett, Michele. I always felt sorry for him. I didn't know any of them well when I lived in Warragul, but I know (1) they were considered a wild bunch and (2) that Gary and his brother were sent away by Hawthorn. To be a great footballer and a Christian, and shy, to be called 'god' many times every month by the media must be distressing. Madness on the part of the media just trying to be smart, insencere having a 'dig' at the faith, and would it happen in a Moslem country. Hardly!

Well the ups and downs of Gary Ablett show that no one is perfect, and as I have suggested before, people are complex.

So I'll bring the discussion back to football saying its a shame that it gets so much media, and the huge payments these guys get, and many other sportsmen get, that top sports are industries of entertainment, while medical reasearchers receive little in money and praise. Is the world crazy, definitely.

I have invited a few people I know to join the group, and I have promised the Americans and the English two, that we will try hard to understand their accents.

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 8:11 pm

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Abblett

Geoff
Thanks for the site.
I did have a peep at it and that was enough for me!!! Didn't I tell you that sport is a foreign language to me????? However, that was really nice of you to pop it there and include me!

In a rush ..... trying not to be!
Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 1:17 pm

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Tuesday, June 07, 2005

Ablett

Here's a link to something on Ablett to let Carol know a bit about what we're talking about. He was a great footballer (I'm not able to judge Gary, whether he was the greatest in our lifetime - maybe Barassi? But then I'm biased). I wouldn't have thought Ablett was eligible for the AFL Hall of Fame yet - on account of the "character" criterion. But on football grounds he's a definite. Interesting, he was a professing Christian once. Is he still? I remember he had concerns about playing football on Sundays once, and also told the truth in a tribunal hearing when he decked Gary Lyon (before my eyes!) once.

Appreciated your personal thoughts and knowledge on Ablett, Michele. You have done a fair bit to redeem him in my eyes!!

# posted by geoff @ 4:38 pm

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Children

CHILDREN

THINGS TO THINK ABOUT!

1. You spend the first two years of their lifeteaching them to walk and talk. Then you spend the next sixteen telling them to sit down and BE QUIET.

2. Grandchildren are God's reward for keeping your own children.

3. Children seldom misquote you.

In fact,they usually repeat word for wordwhat you shouldn't have said.

4. The main purpose of holding children's parties is to remind yourself that there are children more awful than your own.

5. We childproofed our homes,but they are still getting in.

ADVICE FOR THE DAY:

Be nice to your kids.They will choose yournursing home one day.

AND FINALLY:

IF YOU HAVE A LOT OF TENSIONAND YOU GET A HEADACHE,DO WHAT IT SAYS ON THE ASPIRIN BOTTLE:
"TAKE TWO ASPIRIN"AND "KEEP AWAY FROM CHILDREN"!!!!!

# posted by Caroline @ 12:46 pm

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Monday, June 06, 2005

Teaching the Youth/Gary Ablett

It is so important to allow the young ones to take part in the services. It is very encouraging to hear of your two boys Carol taking part. Over the years our four children have often taken part in church services as we believe that it is a training time for them for the future. After all - they are the church of tomorrow. At present our third child, Jonathan, takes part regularly in prayer and leading at the Lord's Table. Our second child, Naomi, is struggling to find a church where she and her husband can be challenged and used. Her whole life has been in our little church so of course it is difficult to adjust to new surroundings at times. Don't be discouraged if other more 'mature' christians(and believe me, you will come across some) do not take kindly to having young people take part. Sometimes they can't see past their own noses.
As for Gary Ablett - me being an old girl from Drouin - I was in the same Form as his sister. My father had the local shoe shop and Mr Ablett would bring all the blond haired kids in - sit them in a row on the bench and say to dad - "Shoe the lot of'em". I caught up with Gary about 12 months ago when I was a relieving receptionist at Kyabram. We spoke of the Lord and the way He can change our lives. When he was staying at Teen Challenge at Kyabram, he was also rooming with a young man who was from our church. They became good friends and Gary had a heart for helping others in similar situations. I believe that he should be in the Hall of Fame as he was one of the greatest footballers of our time. BUT as Eddy said on the 'Footy Show' last Thursday, the specifications for eligibility to be in the 'Hall of Fame' need to be reviewed as there would not be one person in that 'Hall' who is completely without error. We all make mistakes in our lives and we have to learn to live with them - as he has.
As for more people to join this site, I'll try. There is one friend in Queensland who was my best buddy at MBI, I'll try to find her e-mail address.
'Til later...

# posted by shellymac @ 6:38 pm

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Sunday, June 05, 2005

Privilege To Serve

"To serve God from ones youth is a privilege."

Couldn't agree more Carol. Great news re Heath & Guy, encourage them to be brave and bold for the Lord! Geoff

# posted by geoff @ 6:55 pm

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Speaking out for the Lord.

Oh my goodness! I will promise to try - but as I said, the type of people I know and spend time with (especially in the christian department) are not at all into lists and blogs and even emails much.

In our church, we have home worship/sharing meetings every Sunday morning. Last week, our two young sons (aged 14 and 9) made an outward choice (the inward having been done quite some time ago) to give their lives to Jesus/God. This means that now, they may, if inspired, become a vocal part of the little home meeting each Sunday. They can pray a short prayer aloud and then share a thought from the scripture and/or their hearts which has helped them at some stage during the past week.

I thought of them this morning, (Sunday) as they quaked in their boots preparing their minds to to (bravely) pray and speak publicly. Many would say, Those POOR little things, this is too hard and they shouldn't need to. I too have those thoughts. However, it came very clearly to me this morning, that these little hearts LOVE the Lord GOD and Love Jesus Christ. And God will be wish to use them to help Him help others, and want them to spend their lives glorifying Him. And so, to be encouraged to speak aloud and pray aloud about the Lord, is actually teaching them to be unafraid to speak about the Lord. To speak about what is in their hearts relating to the Lord!

One hears christians often say they "want to be a shining light". Yes, a light doesn't need to make a sound! However, there are times when a person does need to speak for the Lord, to assist others and to glorify God. So, I felt what these kids are doing, and being encouraged to do, is actually one way in helping them to speak out and openly of their hearts feelings for the Lord.

To serve God from ones youth is a privilege.

Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 11:09 am

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People and contrasts

I was at a church event yesterday and the speaker was an ex-footballer, talking on many things but stressing faith and persoanal development. There were a few interesting stories from the man's time as a footballer, coach ABC commenttator and state selctor.

For a while he made a contrast between Gary Ablett and James Hird. (Geoff thinks that Hird is a great player, I don't and think he gets his free kicks easily), but the man speaking and many of us think that Ablett was the best player in living memory. Anyway James Hird is married, involved in the media, well spoken and confident without being arrogant. Gary Ablett was always paranoid about the media, shy, variable, naieve, yet excellent with children and visiting elderly and disabled people. He now lives as a recluse in the Blue Mountains, and has not taken up some offers to be in the media, Christian organisations, or again involved in Geelong Football Club.

I don't know if he is still a Christian. I am sure that he is a complex and troubled person. Are not we all? Am I right that most of are are very shy?

We need to invite more people into this group. Geoff stop claiming to be too busy, use the mouse with one hand and finish the drink with the other and listen to the radio with your ears. Michelle you do know some people. I'm in the process, Carol you too.

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:19 am

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Friday, June 03, 2005

People??

Geoff, who is James Hird? Is he the bloke who playes the violin?

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 8:41 pm

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How to invite...

... new members. You go into "Settings - Members" then type the email address and a brief word of invitation. Easy for a bright cookie like you, Gary. BTW, James looks sharp - Mr Nice Guy in the flesh!

# posted by geoff @ 11:55 am

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Gary the Leader!

Gary, just in the airport lounge waiting to fly to Canberra. Sitting next to James Hird and a bunch of his Essendon mates. I am just about to tick the box, making you a co-administrator of this blog (with Carol & me). That means you can invite as many as you like to join with us. I appreciate you doing that - somehow, my life is just too busy but will be easing up in a couple of weeks!

Enjoying all the vigorous contributions everybody - thanks! And best wishes as you attempt to breath new life into this, Gary.

# posted by geoff @ 11:51 am

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Thursday, June 02, 2005

Personalities

I think that the way people share has to do with their personalities. Especially when it comes to speaking about the Lord and 'deep stuff'.
The wives of my two brothers can speak very openly about the Lord and what He has done and is doing in their lives, also my husband's sister finds it a natural thing to speak in such a way. (Carol - I reckon you'd get on really well with them) But me, myself and I, can at times feel uncomfortable. After the morning service, I stay for a very short time as I usually have my Mother to take care of and I often have a tribe coming for lunch and need to get away to the oven, at least that's the excuse that I use. When I attended the Ladies' Bible Study there would be very deep and meaningful conversations and often these conversations would carry over to the after church chit chat.In my work as a medical receptionist, I have found that there are opportunities to speak at length to some of the patients, but of course I need to be careful being in a work situation.
My husband is amazing the way he can go up to different people and have an indepth conversation after just meeting them for the first time, he seems to know the right thing to say when a person is upset or grieving. I prefer to let him do the talking, I'll give the person a hug as words and me get muddled.
But sadly it is true that we seem to talk about the weather from every possible angle and the current 'hot spots' eg Schaphelle Corby, but it is not too often that we truly give of ourselves in conversation.

At present my husband is going through Baptismal Classes with five of our church folk. He has thoroughly enjoyed the 'one on one' with them as they ask so many questions and he is able to share with them. All five will be getting baptised by immersion on the 12th in the afternoon which is pretty exciting in our little church.

'Til next time .....

# posted by shellymac @ 9:01 pm

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agreed Carol but

Do all people have a spiritual aspect in them or have they blocked it and killed it long ago? There are plenty in my family with no faith or no interest.

Anyway I agree with you and I want to delve into deep things. Is the problem that so many of us are shy, too hesitant?

I was asked about the Anglican Church and the R. C. Church recently and my answer is that in the Anglican Church there is everything, people who believe very much the same as the R.C.s and those who are poles apart. Thus some who concur on the Mariology and some who think its rubbish.

Is it at all scriptual, no! so whether Mary appeared at Lourdes or Fatima I'll let it pass me by.

I feel sorry about the R.C. church and its crisis over clergy and nuns. Living near Yarra Theological College I know that if married clergy were allowed they would have plenty, while the present glergy and nuns are mostly geriatricsdying out slowly.

gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 6:51 pm

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Wednesday, June 01, 2005

chit chat with people or real stuff?

Gary, I think it depends on the people, rather than the church. You meet people in all walks of life where the conversation doesn't go much further than what you mentioned in your post.

As far as some good spiritual talk goes, I think a lot of people have it inside them, but find it difficult to bring it out into the open.... wear their hearts on their sleeves, so to speak. That is probably their personality. I was recently talking very openly (and passionately) to one of our ministers about how much I love the Lord, and he was quite uncomfortable with the conversation. Probably thought I was "over the top". To tell you the truth, most people think I am over the top as far as all topics pertaining to our relationship with the Lord goes!!!!! When I find someone who loves to talk of these things, I am "home"!!!!

Unfortunately chit chat has become a little boring to me now...... but I know we must be kind of masters in that art, if we want to be able to reach out to people for a more glorious reason! I find if I speak passionately about my great depth of love for the Lord, it either turns people off (they start yawning!) or on the odd occasion, it makes them curious. They want that too. Yes, all this is an interesting topic of which we could discuss from many angles. I am sure a cab driver would become master in the art of working out different personalities!!!

Love Carol

# posted by Caroline @ 9:18 pm

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on loneliness

Good to hear from you Carol.
Regarding what you mentioned on loneliness I am sure that you know heaps of lonely people, they may be busy, busy with work (usually professional jobs), and I would suggest plenty in the church. We need to open our eyes and we will see them. Oh after church we talk to people, shallow talk about the weather, cars, sport, holidays, and families, really deep stuff! Is that true, the way it is in your church, yours Michele, Geoff ....

Gary

# posted by Anonymous @ 7:02 pm

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